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(01-24-2020, 12:12 PM)3rdgensooner Wrote: If the Christian view of creation is correct then god made p!tch. Yeah yeah free will yada yada. Yes, Pitch is a creation of God. Pitch was given a mind and ability to think and have an intellect and choose right and wrong. Pitch was made in the image of God. Pitch was given the free will as I said, and his ultimate destination is up to him. A Way has been provided. If his posting on here is any indication, and I suspect it is, he's far too smart to choose that Way.
(01-24-2020, 12:17 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (01-24-2020, 11:56 AM)Alabuckeye Wrote: it's a valid question.....we've gone around this mulberry bush a number of times and I've given answers, and you've not really listened to anything I said. You ask to argue and respond, not learn.
I'm resolved to take a new approach (at least with some people), realizing that my snarky approach isn't conducive to constructive conversation.
(01-24-2020, 12:17 PM)Alabuckeye Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:12 PM)3rdgensooner Wrote: If the Christian view of creation is correct then god made p!tch. Yeah yeah free will yada yada. Yes, Pitch is a creation of God. Pitch was given a mind and ability to think and have an intellect and choose right and wrong. Pitch was made in the image of God. Pitch was given the free will as I said, and his ultimate destination is up to him. A Way has been provided. If his posting on here is any indication, and I suspect it is, he's far too smart to choose that Way.
Free will is one of my favorite topics.....
I assume that we are similar in that we were taken to/forced to go to church as children. I grew up in very traditional Lutheran churches where, I'm guessing, we heard similar messages as children in Sunday School and probably similar messages for as long as we were both going to church. There aren't really any new stories/angles in the Bible.
Clearly the message that we received (including pastors, teachers, parents, etc) resonated with you to the point that you have dedicated yourself to your religious beliefs. That similar message didn't resonate with me.  Do you think you CHOSE whether or not the message you received resonated with you?  Do you think I CHOSE whether or not the message I received resonated with me? Meaning, do we really control how the things we hear, read and see impact us and our opinion?
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(01-24-2020, 12:17 PM)Alabuckeye Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:12 PM)3rdgensooner Wrote: If the Christian view of creation is correct then god made p!tch. Yeah yeah free will yada yada. Yes, Pitch is a creation of God. Pitch was given a mind and ability to think and have an intellect and choose right and wrong. Pitch was made in the image of God. Pitch was given the free will as I said, and his ultimate destination is up to him. A Way has been provided. If his posting on here is any indication, and I suspect it is, he's far too smart to choose that Way. Not the best selling point for that particular belief.Â
(01-24-2020, 12:29 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:17 PM)Alabuckeye Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:12 PM)3rdgensooner Wrote: If the Christian view of creation is correct then god made p!tch. Yeah yeah free will yada yada. Yes, Pitch is a creation of God. Pitch was given a mind and ability to think and have an intellect and choose right and wrong. Pitch was made in the image of God. Pitch was given the free will as I said, and his ultimate destination is up to him. A Way has been provided. If his posting on here is any indication, and I suspect it is, he's far too smart to choose that Way.
Free will is one of my favorite topics.....
I assume that we are similar in that we were taken to/forced to go to church as children. I grew up in very traditional Lutheran churches where, I'm guessing, we heard similar messages as children in Sunday School and probably similar messages for as long as we were both going to church. There aren't really any new stories/angles in the Bible.
Clearly the message that we received resonated with you to the point that you have dedicated yourself to your religious beliefs. That similar message didn't resonate with me and, the questions I've asked church pastors have never been answered to my satisfaction.  Do you think you CHOSE whether or not the message you received resonated with you?  Do you think I CHOSE whether or not the message I received resonated with me? Meaning, do we really control how the things we hear, read and see impact us and our opinion?
Try as you might, you cannot wiggle out of being held accountable for your choices by falsely equating your personal experience to be an universal experience.
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(01-24-2020, 12:29 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:17 PM)Alabuckeye Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:12 PM)3rdgensooner Wrote: If the Christian view of creation is correct then god made p!tch. Yeah yeah free will yada yada. Yes, Pitch is a creation of God. Pitch was given a mind and ability to think and have an intellect and choose right and wrong. Pitch was made in the image of God. Pitch was given the free will as I said, and his ultimate destination is up to him. A Way has been provided. If his posting on here is any indication, and I suspect it is, he's far too smart to choose that Way.
Free will is one of my favorite topics.....
I assume that we are similar in that we were taken to/forced to go to church as children. I grew up in very traditional Lutheran churches where, I'm guessing, we heard similar messages as children in Sunday School and probably similar messages for as long as we were both going to church. There aren't really any new stories/angles in the Bible.
Clearly the message that we received (including pastors, teachers, parents, etc) resonated with you to the point that you have dedicated yourself to your religious beliefs. That similar message didn't resonate with me.  Do you think you CHOSE whether or not the message you received resonated with you?  Do you think I CHOSE whether or not the message I received resonated with me? Meaning, do we really control how the things we hear, read and see impact us and our opinion? Yes, I did. Between the ages of 18 and 28 I threw out a ton of what I heard, and more succinctly, how it was communicated to me. I dug in and studied and prayed and learned for myself. I'm not living my parents religion Â
You, on the other hand, chose as well. You threw out what you heard and decided you were infinitely smarter and more understanding, and now follow your own understanding.
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Brutus Buckeye
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(01-24-2020, 12:59 PM)3rdgensooner Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:17 PM)Alabuckeye Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:12 PM)3rdgensooner Wrote: If the Christian view of creation is correct then god made p!tch. Yeah yeah free will yada yada. Yes, Pitch is a creation of God. Pitch was given a mind and ability to think and have an intellect and choose right and wrong. Pitch was made in the image of God. Pitch was given the free will as I said, and his ultimate destination is up to him. A Way has been provided. If his posting on here is any indication, and I suspect it is, he's far too smart to choose that Way. Not the best selling point for that particular belief.Â
Heh. That would suck.
(01-24-2020, 01:55 PM)Alabuckeye Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:29 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:17 PM)Alabuckeye Wrote: (01-24-2020, 12:12 PM)3rdgensooner Wrote: If the Christian view of creation is correct then god made p!tch. Yeah yeah free will yada yada. Yes, Pitch is a creation of God. Pitch was given a mind and ability to think and have an intellect and choose right and wrong. Pitch was made in the image of God. Pitch was given the free will as I said, and his ultimate destination is up to him. A Way has been provided. If his posting on here is any indication, and I suspect it is, he's far too smart to choose that Way.
Free will is one of my favorite topics.....
I assume that we are similar in that we were taken to/forced to go to church as children. I grew up in very traditional Lutheran churches where, I'm guessing, we heard similar messages as children in Sunday School and probably similar messages for as long as we were both going to church. There aren't really any new stories/angles in the Bible.
Clearly the message that we received (including pastors, teachers, parents, etc) resonated with you to the point that you have dedicated yourself to your religious beliefs. That similar message didn't resonate with me.  Do you think you CHOSE whether or not the message you received resonated with you?  Do you think I CHOSE whether or not the message I received resonated with me? Meaning, do we really control how the things we hear, read and see impact us and our opinion? Yes, I did. Between the ages of 18 and 28 I threw out a ton of what I heard, and more succinctly, how it was communicated to me. I dug in and studied and prayed and learned for myself. I'm not living my parents religion Â
I don't doubt that you did, but something you were exposed to (or not exposed to) created that desire to dig and study. For me, something I was exposed to (or not exposed to) made me not want to dig in. Neither of us can control the impact of what we were exposed to, right?
You, on the other hand, chose as well. You threw out what you heard and decided you were infinitely smarter and more understanding, and now follow your own understanding.
I don't see any connection to smartness/intelligence. I looked into several things relating to religion, science, history, etc and, by no fault of my own, was inclined to separate from religion. I couldn't help my reaction any more than you could help your reaction. You couldn't make yourself disinterested in religion unless you somehow took in new information that tripped a switch in your head.
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