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(07-05-2019, 12:03 PM)BoyGenius Wrote: (07-05-2019, 11:51 AM)zigbee Wrote: Non compliance is not law abiding.  Stop, obey, and you won't get your ass kicked is the key. Really easy to do unless you are a freaking idiot.
+1... Pitch says cops have every right to expect compliance yet he doesn't believe cops should have the authority to force compliance on anyone not complying.
And then... P1tch says appropriate charges should be brought against the perp and the justice system should determine the consequences for non-compliance. How is a noncomplying "perp" charged and brought to court for noncompliance when cops shouldn't be given the authority to force compliance on those who don't comply. He could never work with the public. NEVER. I've been in public type jobs my whole life.  Schools, prisons, college..takes common sense and logic to deal with people and most police use this. But in some cases you have in the dealings tricky situations that may lead to you getting hurt if the people do not comply.  Force is needed then.
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(07-05-2019, 12:03 PM)BoyGenius Wrote: (07-05-2019, 11:51 AM)zigbee Wrote: Non compliance is not law abiding.  Stop, obey, and you won't get your ass kicked is the key. Really easy to do unless you are a freaking idiot.
+1... Pitch says cops have every right to expect compliance yet he doesn't believe cops should have the authority to force compliance on anyone not complying.
And then... P1tch says appropriate charges should be brought against the perp and the justice system should determine the consequences for non-compliance. How is a noncomplying "perp" charged and brought to court for noncompliance when cops shouldn't be given the authority to force compliance on those who don't comply.
"Forcing compliance" isn't the same as "kicking the crap out of someone who isn't threatening you".
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(07-05-2019, 12:32 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (07-05-2019, 12:03 PM)BoyGenius Wrote: (07-05-2019, 11:51 AM)zigbee Wrote: Non compliance is not law abiding.  Stop, obey, and you won't get your ass kicked is the key. Really easy to do unless you are a freaking idiot.
+1... Pitch says cops have every right to expect compliance yet he doesn't believe cops should have the authority to force compliance on anyone not complying.
And then... P1tch says appropriate charges should be brought against the perp and the justice system should determine the consequences for non-compliance. How is a noncomplying "perp" charged and brought to court for noncompliance when cops shouldn't be given the authority to force compliance on those who don't comply.
"Forcing compliance" isn't the same as "kicking the crap out of someone who isn't threatening you". It's your opinion on threatening. You really don't know as you are not involved. Making a mistake could be a death sentence.
Make America Honest Again
(07-05-2019, 12:02 PM)Alabuckeye Wrote: and when you conflate situations....as you typically do......you create a story line that all cops are bad.
The ones that shoot perps with knives are no different than the ones that beat up a handcuffed prisoner in a cell.
I've never said all cops are bad. I'm quite certain that there are many good cops.
A perp with a knife is a threat, regardless of whether or not you're a cop. I, an average US citizen, could defend myself in the same way. Michael Brown wasn't armed, but I think the cop used the correct force in that situation.
(07-05-2019, 12:32 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (07-05-2019, 12:03 PM)BoyGenius Wrote: (07-05-2019, 11:51 AM)zigbee Wrote: Non compliance is not law abiding.  Stop, obey, and you won't get your ass kicked is the key. Really easy to do unless you are a freaking idiot.
+1... Pitch says cops have every right to expect compliance yet he doesn't believe cops should have the authority to force compliance on anyone not complying.
And then... P1tch says appropriate charges should be brought against the perp and the justice system should determine the consequences for non-compliance. How is a noncomplying "perp" charged and brought to court for noncompliance when cops shouldn't be given the authority to force compliance on those who don't comply.
"Forcing compliance" isn't the same as "kicking the crap out of someone who isn't threatening you".
The World According To P1tch
(07-05-2019, 12:48 PM)BoyGenius Wrote: (07-05-2019, 12:32 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (07-05-2019, 12:03 PM)BoyGenius Wrote: (07-05-2019, 11:51 AM)zigbee Wrote: Non compliance is not law abiding.  Stop, obey, and you won't get your ass kicked is the key. Really easy to do unless you are a freaking idiot.
+1... Pitch says cops have every right to expect compliance yet he doesn't believe cops should have the authority to force compliance on anyone not complying.
And then... P1tch says appropriate charges should be brought against the perp and the justice system should determine the consequences for non-compliance. How is a noncomplying "perp" charged and brought to court for noncompliance when cops shouldn't be given the authority to force compliance on those who don't comply.
"Forcing compliance" isn't the same as "kicking the crap out of someone who isn't threatening you".
The World According To P1tch
There are a lot of people who agree with me and, with the help of body cams and cell phones, the unwarranted violence of police is being exposed and changes are happening.
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To think policing is infallible is really a misnomer.  Like any profession mistakes occur.
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(07-05-2019, 01:15 PM)zigbee Wrote: To think policing is infallible is really a misnomer.  Like any profession mistakes occur.
Agree 100%. However, there are two issues:  a) we (society) have been conditioned to believe that people who resist deserve to be punched, kicked, kneed, bloodied, etc JUST for resisting and b) prior to portable video devices/body cams, cops could make up anything to explain injuries to suspects - "He was resisting and hit his head during the struggle".
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(07-05-2019, 01:37 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (07-05-2019, 01:15 PM)zigbee Wrote: To think policing is infallible is really a misnomer.  Like any profession mistakes occur.
Agree 100%. However, there are two issues:  a) we (society) have been conditioned to believe that people who resist deserve to be punched, kicked, kneed, bloodied, etc JUST for resisting and b) prior to portable video devices/body cams, cops could make up anything to explain injuries to suspects - "He was resisting and hit his head during the struggle". Again, you really are saying all situations are the same. Generalizing about police work is dangerous business as they protect the innocent.Â
Put down a gun. No. Bang, dead. Put down a knife. No, bang dead.  Put hands behind back for cuffs. No, slam, cuffs on. Put hands in air. No, slam, cuffed.  Take hands from pockets. No, slam, cuffed. Stop running. No, bang, injured or dead. Pretty simple really. Comply and all is well. Act stupid and pay the price.
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(07-05-2019, 01:37 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (07-05-2019, 01:15 PM)zigbee Wrote: To think policing is infallible is really a misnomer.  Like any profession mistakes occur.
Agree 100%. However, there are two issues:  a) we (society) have been conditioned to believe that people who resist deserve to be punched, kicked, kneed, bloodied, etc JUST for resisting and b) prior to portable video devices/body cams, cops could make up anything to explain injuries to suspects - "He was resisting and hit his head during the struggle".
a) No, we have not, at all. This is false.
b)Â This also is false, the could get away with more obviously, but they couldn't just make up things and get away with it.
You watch too many movies and see some youtubes that look bad without considering the context of thousands of interactions that take place each day that don't make it to youtube because the cop acted appropriately.
(07-05-2019, 04:44 PM)cincydawg Wrote: (07-05-2019, 01:37 PM)P1tchblack Wrote: (07-05-2019, 01:15 PM)zigbee Wrote: To think policing is infallible is really a misnomer.  Like any profession mistakes occur.
Agree 100%. However, there are two issues:  a) we (society) have been conditioned to believe that people who resist deserve to be punched, kicked, kneed, bloodied, etc JUST for resisting and b) prior to portable video devices/body cams, cops could make up anything to explain injuries to suspects - "He was resisting and hit his head during the struggle".
a) No, we have not, at all. This is false.
b)Â This also is false, the could get away with more obviously, but they couldn't just make up things and get away with it.
You watch too many movies and see some youtubes that look bad without considering the context of thousands of interactions that take place each day that don't make it to youtube because the cop acted appropriately.
A) it's not false at all. Most everyone here, including me at one point in my life, was of the attitude that if you didn't listen to police, you got whatever you deserved.
B) this is also not false. The average suspect / criminal, without the aid of some kind of video recording, would have no chance accusing a cop of much of anything and expecting for the cop to be held accountable.
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